Diego Mendoza-Moyers: Meta’s data center campus in El Paso is moving forward. 

Hundreds of citizens have lined up at City Council meetings, telling elected officials to cancel the deal enabling Meta’s data center, or to attend the city’s data center public meetings to voice concerns and objections about the project. But Meta has 1,500 workers already at the site in Northeast El Paso, near the Texas-New Mexico state line, and the company’s already poured foundations and is moving forward with construction. 

And as Meta develops its data center, El Paso Electric is working at the same time to rapidly build a natural gas power plant over the next year. Normally, building a big electric generating plant takes several years, but Meta doesn’t have that time. 

Amid the federal government’s push to have American companies win the artificial intelligence race against China and other countries, Meta is building one node in its network of infrastructure to enable AI here in El Paso. 

So, El Paso Electric is moving fast. So fast that the company opted to build a fossil fuel plant instead of a solar farm to power the data center like the public and elected officials originally expected. 

People are upset about the data center. How much water will it use? What about air pollution from the on-site power plant? Will my electric bills go up? And in the bigger picture, should we believe that exchanging our natural resources to Meta in exchange for jobs and tax revenue is a good trade for the people of El Paso? 

I’m Diego Mendoza-Moyers, a reporter with El Paso Matters. In just a moment, I’ll talk with editor Pablo Villa about the latest updates on Meta’s data center, where the electricity will come from, and the potential impact this data center will have here.

And before I talk with Pablo, I want to mention that this El Paso Matters podcast episode is brought to you by our podcast title sponsor, Tawney, Acosta and Chaparro, truck crash and injury attorneys. Their team of local, seasoned trial attorneys are ready to help if you’ve been injured in a crash. 

And you can sign up for El Paso Matters’ free newsletter and read our reporting at our website, elpasomatters.org. 

On to the show. 

Pablo, appreciate you joining me. 

Pablo Villa: Diego, thank you very much for having me. I do want to say that it’s great to have you back. I know you’ve been out for a little while. But we’re certainly grateful that you’ve returned and are ready to get this show going. And a pleasure for me to be in the chair, of course. 

Diego: Yeah, hit the ground running with all this data center stuff going on. 

Pablo: Yeah, absolutely. You haven’t been able to take a break at all from that, even though you just got back. 

So, yeah, the last time this podcast took a close look at data centers in our region, the conversation was centered on two major developments, right? And I want to make that distinction early, because I know we’re only going to talk about one of them today. 

But one was just across the state line in New Mexico, right, known as Project Jupiter. The other one is, of course, a little closer to home. That’s Meta’s planned data center in the Northeast. 

Those are two separate projects, two separate companies. They have different developers, different timelines and different implications for the communities that surround them, right? 

But they’re often discussed together, and some of the details get conflated between the two because they do reflect something bigger, right? And that’s the growing push to build these large-scale data infrastructure centers across the region, right? Of course, driven by the rise of artificial intelligence. 

And today, as you mentioned, we’re going to focus specifically on the Meta data center in Northeast El Paso. 

Since we last talked about it back in December, that project has evolved significantly, right? The scale has increased, new infrastructure plans have come into focus. And with that, I have a number of questions and concerns from residents, from policymakers, and from advocates in our community. And I know we’ll get into the concerns, right, but they range from water use to air pollution and plenty of other things, right? 

So, today we’re going to walk through those concerns a little bit, point by point, based on all the reporting that you’ve done. And I know you were just at a meeting yesterday. 

So, hopefully, you can try to help us better understand what’s happening, what’s changed, and what it could mean moving forward, alright? 

Diego: Sure. 

Pablo: So, let’s start by grounding listeners, if you would. Where are we now with the Meta data center, specifically, and what’s changed in the past few months? 

Diego: Yeah.So, to your point, this Meta facility is a really big data center that’ll be in Northeast El Paso, kind of in the expanse of desert right around the Texas-New Mexico state line, like I said at the top. Just to differentiate that from Project Jupiter, like you’re saying, across the state line in Sunland Park – that’s an even bigger project. Totally separate, though, from El Paso Electric’s kind of partnership with Meta. 

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Project Jupiter will have its own microgrid, its own power plants, its own kind of setup over there. And it’s got its own concerns, right, and its own objections and so forth. 

But for El Paso, right now, the main project is this Meta data center that is within the city limits. The city and county granted tax breaks to enable the investment, I guess, by Meta in December 2023. 

So, that’s really what kicked us all off and why people say, “Hey, when was this decision made? And why was there a vote on whether Meta was going to come here or not?” And the reality is, like, there was a vote. It was just two-and-a-half years ago before this was as pertinent an issue, I guess. 

And, so, in the last few months, I would say that the big updates we’ve seen are Meta breaking ground at the site, construction commencing. I said at the top, they have around 1,500 workers. I believe at the peak, they’re going to have 4,000 people working construction at the site. So, they broke ground a few months ago. 

At the same time, late last year, El Paso Electric sent this – basically, a request to the Public Utility Commission to build a power plant on-site for Meta’s facility dedicated solely to Meta. This power plant, at least initially, won’t connect into the broader grid. It will just be there to serve Meta. And it’s really expensive. It’s a $500 million natural gas plant, which I think shows the urgency of Meta to pay whatever it takes to get power and to have electricity for the facility ASAP by next year. 

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So, $500 million gas plant, it’s 366 megawatts, which is really big. And El Paso Electric, they’re really moving super fast to build it. They’re working with a company called Enchanted Rock. And it’s not so much a centralized generating station like we’re used to seeing – these, like, really big industrial facilities. It’s actually a collection of over 800 small generators. They’re the same generators that the grocery store chain H-E-B uses as, like, store backup. 

And, so, El Paso Electric just is taking over 800 of them, stacking them together, and they’re just going to run all the time, basically, for Meta’s facility. The benefit, I guess, for El Paso Electric in their eyes is that this technology is, like, very reliable. They’re just these little small gas-fired generators. And, so, they’re kind of building it so that if some of them go off, they can rely on other ones. And the point being, it’ll run all the time and be reliable. 

Of course, a natural gas power plant, even if it’s not, like, a normal plant, it’s still a natural gas, a collection of natural gas generators that will produce pollution. And that’s different than the initial plan as communicated by El Paso Electric and Meta to rely on renewables and solar, specifically, in the communications with the Public Utility Commission from a couple of years ago even, or last year. 

El Paso Electric had even said, like, “Yeah, we think it’ll be two solar farms, and we think they’ll be this big.” And they had already kind of started laying out their plans for how to develop solar farms to power this facility. I think maybe the timeline became more urgent for Meta and they said, “Hey, we don’t have time to wait for you to build a solar farm. We need this collection of generators put together ASAP.” 

So that’s kind of a concern and we can get more into it. But that’s, I would say, the big updates. 

Oh, and then I – well, I can’t forget that Meta increased the investment exponentially, right from $1.5 billion to $10 billion they just announced a week or two ago. 

So, that will result in the number of workers at the data center once it’s built, full-time employees, Meta says they’ll hire 300 people. Initially, I think the expectation was 100 people. So, you know, increase there. 

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Obviously, increasing the investment from $1.5 billion to $10 billion will likely mean more tax revenue for local taxing entities like University Medical Center or EPCC or the city and county. 

So, those are the big updates. It’s that this project is really crystallizing right? It’s coming together. The construction’s very much ongoing. And I think, technically, El Paso Electric hasn’t won full approval to build this power plant, but I think they’re on track. And I think we can safely say this project is happening. The power plant’s going to be built next to it. And this is going to be a massive industrial site in Northeast El Paso. 

Pablo: Yeah, I did want to get into what El Paso Electric is doing, right? And you’ve given us a really good overview of the scope of the energy needs that this facility is going to need. Can you talk to us a little bit about – or provide some details on what this is going to mean for ratepayers heading into the next five years?

Diego: Yeah. So, first and foremost, actually today the final order was issued in El Paso Electric’s rate increase that’s been ongoing for like, almost a year-and-a-half that people might have heard of. It’s about a 23% increase for residential customers. So, that was officially approved by the Public Utility Commission today. That’s totally separate from the Meta data center – has nothing to do with the Meta data center. 

I know that’s kind of not the popular perception, but the fact is the rate increase that’s about to take effect – we’re all going to experience higher bills – and that’s a result of El Paso Electric spending on things, like, four or five years ago, right? That now they’re just now recouping that cost from customers. An example is the – El Paso Electric spent $217 million building the Newman 6 power plant, also in Northeast El Paso. That’s kind of one of many things they’re trying to collect from us. 

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And, so, number one, the rate increase that’s on the table right now about to take effect has nothing to do with data centers. 

And El Paso Electric has been adamant to say that Meta’s paying every penny of the cost of what El Paso Electric is spending to build this power plant. And not only the power plant, but also substations around there. El Paso Electric has said they built three substations to serve Meta. Again, I mean, just shows you the scale of the electricity infrastructure required to build a data center. I believe that Meta’s paid El Paso Electric $192 million to build those substations. So, those are big infrastructure projects on their own. 

But, as far as rates, El Paso Electric is, again, very adamant that Meta will pay every penny. And I wrote a story this past weekend because there is a line in the application that El Paso Electric is asking the regulators to let them build this power plant.

But there’s a line in there that I think caught everybody by surprise when they, basically it said that for the first one to five years, this is only going to serve Meta. It won’t be connected to the grid. It’s kind of like Meta’s private power plant. 

But then, after a few years, then EPE would incorporate that power plant that it’s building just for Meta into the broader grid. And what that means is that all of us pay for it, right? Anything that’s on the grid that we all make use of, we all pay for. 

That raised a red flag to me, right? Like, this is a weird configuration, very expensive, right? It’s not a typical power plant. I don’t think if Meta wasn’t coming here – and Kelly Tomlin said this, the CEO of El Paso Electric – this is not something they would build for customers because it’s so expensive, kind of weird, kind of unproven technology. 

So, now El Paso Electric is saying, “Look, even if Meta leaves, even if they say, ‘Actually, in three years, we don’t want to be in El Paso anymore, we’re shutting down, forget this investment, we’re moving on.’” Even if that’s the case, El Paso Electric says “Meta’s going to be on the hook for the $500 million price of this power plant no matter what.” 

So, that’s something that El Paso Electric says: “Look, we’ve got the customer safeguards in place. Meta’s not going to be subsidized under any circumstance, really.” Of course, the contract between Meta and El Paso Electric is confidential. You can’t access that publicly through the Public Utility Commission.

So, you know, you just have to kind of take El Paso’s word for it that there will be no subsidy and that Meta’s paying all the cost. 

And just kind of one more point on this. El Paso Electric actually argues that it’s beneficial for you, me, everybody who pays an El Paso Electric bill, it’s beneficial for Meta to show up here. 

And I think this is a concept that kind of trips people up, or maybe people don’t buy, but it’s that El Paso Electric’s got a power grid that exists today, right? And regardless of how much energy they sell us, there’s going to be poles, there’s going to be power plants, there’s going to be substations they have to pay for. And, so, if they sell more energy, they’re kind of, like, spreading the cost over more unit sales of electricity, right? So, on a per unit basis, it’s cheaper. It gets a little wonky. 

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But the point being that Meta’s arrival means that Meta absorbs a lot of the fixed costs to maintain the grid and the existing El Paso Electric ratepayers – El Paso Electric says we will all pay collectively $40 million less per year because Meta’s now picking up that cost of maintaining the grid, essentially. 

Again, we need to interrogate that more, explore the numbers, explore that more. But that really caught my attention. El Paso Electric just told the city yesterday, Meta’s arrival means the rest of us are paying $40 million less because Meta’s picking up that tab. So, buy it or not, that’s the argument from EPE that we’re actually all benefiting from Meta’s arrival. 

Pablo: Yeah, really good information. I like that you made a distinction between the fact that this may or may not be something that we have to absorb, but on top of that, there is a rate increase that El Paso Electric has been seeking for quite some time that was approved today, right? So, we’re going to see a rise in our month-to-month bills anyway. 

Diego: Absolutely. A large rise. 

Pablo: Yeah, and I know you’re going to probably have to suss out what that actually means for our pocketbooks, and I know you’re going to provide more information on that. But it is something that I think a lot of opponents of the data centers have been concerned about, expressing concern about, and rightfully so, right? But I think there are some, there’s some additional context that needs to be taken into account, right? 

Diego: Yeah. And I’ll just say, like, affordability is a concern for all of us, right? Not to dismiss that rising bills are a challenge for a lot of people. I just don’t think that the rate increase – I know that the rate increase we’re about to experience is not a result of Meta developing a data center here. 

Pablo: And I’m definitely not looking forward to it myself either, right? So, that’s the power side of things. There’s a whole other side of this having to do with water, right? 

Water has been a major point of discussion, even of concern among some people in town. Because this is El Paso, we’re in the middle of the Chihuahuan Desert. Water is not a resource that we can come by as regularly as some other parts of the country, right? So, what do we actually know about how much water this project would use, this Meta project would use, and what are local officials saying about whether the system can handle it? There’s been some distinction between overall supply and infrastructure capacity and those kinds of things. Can you kind of suss that out for us and explain? 

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Diego: El Paso Water CEO John Balliew has told me their estimates are that, over the course of a year, on average, the Meta data center will consume 400,000 gallons of water per day. Of course, that could vary by day. I think if it’s hotter, that could trigger the need for more water usage by Meta. But, over the course of a year, 400,000 gallons per day. 

So, to put that in perspective, El Paso Water pumps, roughly, 110 million gallons of water per day. That could get up to 160 million during the summer. So, we’re talking an average of 110 million gallons per day. You’re essentially adding 400,000 gallons of demand. So, you do the math. That’s half a percent, one-third of a percent, something like that, right? Less than 1%. 

So, I think the sort of additional water demand is manageable. And I think that’s due to the fact that Meta is using air cooling and kind of different cooling technologies than data centers have used elsewhere where you hear about millions of gallons of daily consumption. 

And so I – when you talk to El Paso Water, and again, we can talk about profit motives and stuff a little bit, especially for El Paso Electric. El Paso Water has no profit incentive for Meta to come here. Like, they don’t get bonuses for selling more water. They don’t make more money or anything like that. They’re a nonprofit, city-owned utility. 

And they say, “Look, we can handle this demand.” The city says, “Look, we’re going to bring in this tax revenue, we’re going to create jobs, that’s worth the 400,000 gallons a day.” Maybe if it was 4 million gallons a day, it wouldn’t be worth it, right? But in El Paso Water’s eyes, they say that’s an OK trade. 

Now, of course, the concerns you see, right, are that we see, through climate change, it’s getting hotter every year, we’re experiencing drought, less water is flowing through the Rio Grande into El Paso, right? Which, typically, the Rio Grande could supply as much as half our water. And we’re seeing that percentage decline, and it’s made-up by pumping more groundwater. 

So, you bring in another big water user, we’re going to pump more groundwater. You’ve heard El Paso Water say, “Hey, we need to sustain our groundwater supplies. We don’t want to overpump, right? That’s our lifeblood for El Paso.”

So, I think that the water usage of Meta’s facility will not be so overwhelming as to affect the supply for other customers. But, in the big picture, like, I do think there’s kind of a sustainability question about welcoming a big user, even if it’s not millions of gallons a day, it’s still 400,000 gallons a day. And is that a good trade? 

Meta says that they will do things to offset their water consumption. So, for example – and it’s still kind of vague, we don’t have details – but they say, like, “We’re going to help farmers in the area get more efficient irrigation systems so, they use millions of gallons less” or whatever, right? They use less water. 

And, so, Meta’s thinking is that “Whatever water our data center consumes, the projects we do in the community will save twice that much water,” right? Again, we’ve got to verify that, right? And we have to see. But that’s what Meta says about the water is, “Hey, we’re already air-cooling, we’re doing a less water-intensive technology, 400,000 gallons a day. And, on the other end, we’re going to do projects to offset that supply and sort of have a net positive impact on the community from a water perspective.” 

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Pablo: Yeah. You talked about air cooling specifically in this part of the discussion. That’s a process – as well as the natural gas power plant, right? Those are things that can potentially produce or will produce pollutants, right? And, so, this is another concern that’s been expressed by local advocates. Our air quality, right? What kind of emissions are expected from this facility in the Northeast and how do those compare to what El Paso is already dealing with in terms of air quality? 

Diego: Yeah. And I’m glad you brought up the power plant. I forgot to mention on the water front, of course, the biggest customer of El Paso Water is El Paso Electric because their power plants are very water-intensive. I believe in the last financial year of El Paso Water, EP Electric bought, like, 19 million gallons of water a day. So, they’re extremely water intensive. 

But the power plant for Meta will not use water, right? It’s these little small generators that don’t use water, they’re air-cooled. So, that’s a key point, because if it was a traditional power plant, you could add millions of gallons of daily usage on top of the data center’s usage. But that’s not the case. El Paso Electric says the power plant for Meta will not use water. So, that’s important. 

As it relates to air quality, this is definitely an important point. And it’s one that – I think El Paso Electric had a lot of good answers and a lot of good explanations of the customer protections on rates and, “Hey, the water usage won’t be overwhelming” and things like that. But the pollution is something they gloss over, right? 

And, to their credit, they are using – this company they’re working with, Enchanted Rock, has different like, generator models, if you will. And they’re using the cleaner one, right? The one that’s less polluting, to El Paso Electric’s credit. 

Still, my estimates are that this power plant will produce something like 40 tons of particulate matter. Which isn’t a massive amount, but that’s still a lot. And in El Paso, the particulate matters are the little small particles in the air that can come from vehicle exhaust or from dust or from combustion at a power plant or whatever. And, so, those are really bad and they’re bad for your health and they get in your bloodstream and can cause health problems. 

And, so, that’s I think the most hazardous pollutant from this McCloud power plant, is what it’s called, that’s Meta’s power plant, because we already have such a high level of particulate matter pollution already. Like, we already way exceed EPA standards in El Paso. And, so, we should probably be reducing particulate pollution as opposed to adding to it. It’s not going to be a massive, massive addition. But it will increase our pollution. 

We don’t know the expected emissions of everything yet. And there’s, like – the TCEQ has kind of put a cap of like, I think they’re allowed to produce around 100 tons of carbon monoxide, several dozen tons of nitrogen oxides, which are harmful. So these aren’t massive, massive numbers, but they’ll meaningfully contribute to our air pollution. And I think for the people living near the plant, it’s not great, right? Like, what are you getting in exchange for, having your air quality slightly worse, right? 

Pablo: Yeah, and so with that, a lot of this is still moving through regulatory channels, right? Can you talk to us a little bit about what the next key decisions or approvals to watch will be and where is there still an opportunity for this project to change or be challenged? 

Diego: Yeah. So, like I mentioned, El Paso Electric’s request to the Public Utility Commission to build this power plant, it’s kind of early in that process. I think it could be maybe the end of the year that that gets officially approved. And, technically, there is a place for ratepayers broadly, anyone who is an El Paso Electric customer, to go to the Public Utility Commission and express your objections, right, to the power plant. 

But I think it’s important to note, like, the Public Utility Commissioners of Texas are appointed by Governor Abbott and are carrying out the certain policy agenda, right, of the state and the state leadership. And, so, the state of Texas, and much like the federal government and the Trump administration, is, like, fully on board with the build out of AI. “We’ve got to do this. We’ve got to get on board now. We’ve got to beat China. We’ve got to beat other countries. And we want to be the global leader in AI, right, and have the AI supply chain here and have AI jobs and all this stuff.” Like, that’s a big government goal. 

And, so, I can’t see any scenario, really, where the Public Utility Commission rejects the power plant that’s enabling a $10 billion data center investment in Texas. You know what I mean? It’s not something I envision happening. 

But that’s still a key regulatory hurdle, I guess, to allow Meta to carry on with its data center. But, yeah, I mean, that’s pretty much it, right? Like, there’s that. 

But the fact is the tax abatement agreements between the city and county have been signed for two-and-a-half years now. I’ll just note it’s an 80% break on city and county taxes. And the city also gave Meta like $12.5 million to pay for road repairs around the data center. Which, even if you look at like, “Hey, maybe the air pollution, it’s not good, but hey, maybe it won’t be disastrous. The water usage may be manageable.” Then you can say, “Well, did we really need to give tax breaks to Meta, right? Like, if they’re going to come here and we’re granting them usage of the resources, do we also need to throw cash on top of that, right?” 

I think maybe people in the city’s economic development office would say, “Well, yeah, the tax revenue we’re going to make from Meta will exceed any of the incentives, so it’s a good deal.” But I think it doesn’t look great to people that this big corporation’s having its costs subsidized by taxpayers. 

Pablo: Yeah, a significant investment already, right? And as you mentioned at the top, there’s a lot of inroads that have already been made. But even with that, for people who are concerned about this project, whether it’s water, air quality, cost, what have you, what options do they have at this point, if any, to make their voices heard or stay engaged in the process? 

Diego: I forgot to mention the city’s data center meetings, right? So, the city’s hosting these meetings. I think they’ve got a few more. The last one, I believe, is April 8th. So they’ve been holding these meetings throughout the city to get feedback on a future policy of how to evaluate data centers and the development of them in El Paso going forward, right? Like, do we want more data centers here? Under what circumstances? Stuff like that. 

I’ve gone to these meetings. They’re usually very well-attended, 100 or more people go. But I think that there’s people showing up asking questions and wanting to know more rather than giving their opinion, which is really what the city’s asking for. Like, “Hey, show up and write your opinion on some sticky notes and tell us how you feel about data centers.” It’s overwhelmingly negative. 

But that’s one venue where – these data center meetings are not meant to be a tool to somehow undo the deal with Meta or block the deal with Meta. I think it’s more forward-looking. Like, if we have another massive tech company talking about doing a billion dollar-plus data center here, how should we react? Should we be open to it? Should we not? So, that’s another place where I would say people can make their opinions heard or sort of say, “No, this isn’t the kind of industry we want.” 

We’ve seen some of the elected officials who approved the tax break agreement back in late 2023, namely District 8 city Representative Chris Canales, he kind of issued a mea culpa, right? A video on social media effectively saying, like, “I regret my vote. Circumstances were different when I approved this. If it was up for a vote now, I wouldn’t approve it.” So, I think that’s been interesting to see a couple of years later, people saying, “Hey, maybe this wasn’t such a good deal.” 

But, yeah, there aren’t a lot of avenues to cancel this. And, in my view, it’s going to go forward. And my hope is just that, El Paso Electric and Meta, I think they’ve been a little bit maybe dismissive of the concerns or not having a ton of respect for the groups that are opposing this project. I think terms like people who oppose it are, like, a virus in the city and stuff like that. 

I just think that there has to be a rebuilding of respect and kind of like dialogue and a recognition of the concerns that people have are valid and trying to address them. I think that would kind of help from a PR aspect, because going to these meetings and talking to people, people are really upset, they want answers. And I think, at times, the people in power making these investment decisions can kind of brush off those concerns. 

Pablo: Yeah, I think that’s been one of the most unfortunate developments in very recent history, is just some of the negative, or the perception of negative words that have come from people who are leading this deal, right? And so that’s a tough thing to watch, but I think you’re right. I think both the companies involved and the public have to come to some sort of happy medium here, right? 

Diego: Yeah. And I mean, like I’ll say, for example, Kelly Tomblin, the CEO of El Paso Electric, she’s an extremely intelligent lady, very personable, knows the industry inside and out and has the right ideas when you talk to her. But then when she goes in front of the camera, she’s talking about, like, “Our load factor is too low, we want to optimize our assets.” I mean, it’s like, nobody knows or cares what you’re talking about. To me, that’s not the language that people need to hear. 

They need to hear stuff like, “So, what’s the benefit of Meta showing up here? Are my taxes going to go down? Are my electric bills going to go down? What is the benefit?” And I’ll be curious to see if the communication we see going forward focuses more on why this is good for El Pasoans and a good deal and less on, like, why El Paso Electric wants to utilize its assets more. You know what I mean? Kind of these abstract talking points that I don’t think are selling anyone in El Paso. 

Pablo: Yeah, and so with that, there will be more information that comes out in the coming weeks and months. There will be more developments. There will be more movement up at the Northeast, right, where this data center is being developed. I know you’re going to be on top of the whole thing, so I encourage all our listeners to check in with us at elpasomatters.org to look for Diego’s coverage on this, because I know he’ll be on it. 

Diego: For sure. Appreciate you taking the time, Pablo. 

Pablo: Thanks, Diego. We’ll close there.

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